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Brandmüller Contradicts Schneider On "Erroneous" Councils

Cardinal Brandmüller has contradicted Bishop Schneider's thesis that there have been errors in councils which later needed to be corrected.

Regarding the Council of Constance (1415-1418) which professed the heresy that a council is above the pope (conciliarism), Brandmüller told Sandro Magister (July 13) that the assembly issuing those decrees didn't constitute a legitimate Ecumenical Council because they were following Anti-Pope John XXIII (+1419).

Only the second part of this Council which proclaimed Martin V as the legitimate pope, is considered to be canonical. Martin V approved all conciliar documents, except those on conciliarism.

Regarding the Council of Florence (1439-1445), Brandmüller admits that it defined that a valid priestly ordination requires the conferral of the instruments of the office (chalice and paten) and that Pius XII established 1947 that this would in future no longer be necessary by declaring that the matter of the sacrament is only the imposition of hands and the prayer of ordination.

Brandmüller tries to get out of this contradiction by saying that the Council of Florence didn't deal with the doctrine of priestly ordination but "only" regulated the liturgical rite - as if doctrine and rite were two things independent from each other and doctrine is not drawn from the liturgy.

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foward
Brandmüller says almost everything well except the last.
Brandmüller does not contradict Schneider, but corrects him in his bad doctrine.

The true Pope did not sign heretical decrees at Constantza.
The Council of Florence was not mistaken about the ordination rite. He established, according to the previous common opinion and of Saint Thomas, the rites that were correct. They represented what …More
Brandmüller says almost everything well except the last.
Brandmüller does not contradict Schneider, but corrects him in his bad doctrine.

The true Pope did not sign heretical decrees at Constantza.
The Council of Florence was not mistaken about the ordination rite. He established, according to the previous common opinion and of Saint Thomas, the rites that were correct. They represented what they meant.
Pius XII could change the form of that rite without changing the essence.

Schneider does not teach Catholic doctrine. Viganò in the letter of June 9 has said it well.
philosopher
Where or when did Pius XII change the form of the mass?
foward
Never. Pius XII changed the form of the rite of priestly ordination. But that form is as correct as the previous ones.
foward
@philosopher I, as Viganò, think that something substantial has broken with the 2VC, and that could not come from the Church, but from the anti-Christian infiltration.
So I think that after Pius XII we do not have a true Pope, which explains everything that happened.
philosopher
Cardinal Brandmuller signed the Dubia but he should study Vatican II more closely. The council of Florence did define some doctrinal points, while Vat 2 defined no doctrine but was a sui generis pastoral council. Let's keep our categories in the proper places.
eticacasanova
Yeah, the council of Florence is one of the greatest in Church's history, the last in which the easterners participated, the last (of many) in which everybody, including the easterners, recognized the supremacy of the Pope. From it come the "uniatas" churches"... Of course, what Brandmuller says is: try, true and true: true in all counts. Constance was a wayward marsillian-ockhamist fancy, in …More
Yeah, the council of Florence is one of the greatest in Church's history, the last in which the easterners participated, the last (of many) in which everybody, including the easterners, recognized the supremacy of the Pope. From it come the "uniatas" churches"... Of course, what Brandmuller says is: try, true and true: true in all counts. Constance was a wayward marsillian-ockhamist fancy, in which ecclesiastics came to their senses, to end the Gran Cisma. One thing is regulate rituals and another, very different, is to set doctrine, as Aristotle says, it is the mark of an educated intellect to tell the proper distinctions. Schneider, who is a great man and bishop, does this to justify his ideas on Vatican II, but there, too, he is lacking proper distinctions