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Sedevacantist Consecration with John Paul II Music

Sedevacantist Bishop Donald Sanborn, 72, "consecrated" Germán Fliess on November 30 as new bishop of his group, the Roman Catholic Institute.

The "consecration" took place in Fraser, Michigan. In his homily, Sandborn justified this step by claiming that there hasn't been a pope since 1958 and that the Vatican has started a new religion after Pius XII.

The surprising part of the ceremony was the inclusion of musical emotionalism of the Council Church, i.e. Father Marco Frisina's Anima Christi (magnificently sung, Video below).

Frisina, 68, the current chapel master of the Lateran Basilica and head of the choir of Rome Diocese, was John Paul II's composer at court (“Jesus Christ, You Are My Life,” "Aprite le porte a Christo”).

Sandborn was ordained a priest by Archbishop Lefebvre but was expelled from PiusX in 1983, and founded the Society of Pius V which he left in 1991. His episcopal lineage goes back to the controversial Huế Archbishop Ngô Đình Thục (+1984) who was excommunicated and reconciled with Rome twice.

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04:10
rhemes1582
How about that: Even after that suggestive title the comments are all still positive!
👏
Kenjiro M. Yoshimori
Why would they be anything but positive? This is the True Mass, This is True Catholicism. Francis and his Vatican are Homo loving Heretics. Catholics who know all that, see all that, and yet say "Yes, Holy Father, Whatever you say is right, Holy Father Francis". are brainwashed robots, and are being led into heresy themselves. Catholics who still cling to the notion of the "Holy Father", GROW UP!!…More
Why would they be anything but positive? This is the True Mass, This is True Catholicism. Francis and his Vatican are Homo loving Heretics. Catholics who know all that, see all that, and yet say "Yes, Holy Father, Whatever you say is right, Holy Father Francis". are brainwashed robots, and are being led into heresy themselves. Catholics who still cling to the notion of the "Holy Father", GROW UP!! Francis is nothing of the kind.
rhemes1582
I am happy to see the comments be positive about the grandeur, and solemnity of the ceremony.
Kenjiro M. Yoshimori
I don't understand? How could anyone criticize this beautiful ceremony, and even beautiful music? Because they are sedevacantists? Schismatics? Not in union with "Our Holy Father?". Grow up, people. This is real Catholicism, and so is the ICRSP, CRMI, and SSPX... not the everyday Novus Ordo Mass, or the garbage spewing out from the Vatican and Pope Francis and his people daily. One of his "cardinals …More
I don't understand? How could anyone criticize this beautiful ceremony, and even beautiful music? Because they are sedevacantists? Schismatics? Not in union with "Our Holy Father?". Grow up, people. This is real Catholicism, and so is the ICRSP, CRMI, and SSPX... not the everyday Novus Ordo Mass, or the garbage spewing out from the Vatican and Pope Francis and his people daily. One of his "cardinals" just invoked the prayers to the "Pachamamma" in November. Being in union with a Pope and Vatican like that is of no value....not in the eyes of God I am sure.
DJRESQ
The problem here is that "Bishop" Sanborn's episcopal consecration is highly suspect, as the original Thuc "consecrations," from which Father Sanborn's alleged consecration derives, are very much in question.
In fact, they were so much in question that, years ago, Father Sanborn himself did not believe they were valid.
Father's claim to be a bishop is dubious at best, and its authenticity cannot …More
The problem here is that "Bishop" Sanborn's episcopal consecration is highly suspect, as the original Thuc "consecrations," from which Father Sanborn's alleged consecration derives, are very much in question.

In fact, they were so much in question that, years ago, Father Sanborn himself did not believe they were valid.

Father's claim to be a bishop is dubious at best, and its authenticity cannot be demonstrated; therefore, there is no way to ascertain the validity of his consecrations. He is, however, a valid priest.

Father Cekada stated that he and Father Sanborn spent 1000 hours trying to determine whether the Thuc consecrations, which were secretive, were valid.

Thuc unfortunately became involved with the Palmar da Troya fiasco, which may have been authentic in the beginning but was usurped by some obviously very unstable people, with Clemente being the major one.
Kenjiro M. Yoshimori
If Thuc was himself validly consecrated a Bishop, then anyone he consecrated a Bishop was valid. That's what I read. And that's what I believe.
DJRESQ
Most of the people who post here are young, so they did not experience what was happening in the traditional Catholic movement in the early years. I'm not young, lived through the changes, and have familiarity with what was going on, as I witnessed some of it firsthand and met some of the main actors. (I met Father Sanborn not too long after he was ordained in the mid 70s.)
The fact that something …More
Most of the people who post here are young, so they did not experience what was happening in the traditional Catholic movement in the early years. I'm not young, lived through the changes, and have familiarity with what was going on, as I witnessed some of it firsthand and met some of the main actors. (I met Father Sanborn not too long after he was ordained in the mid 70s.)

The fact that something has the appearance of holiness, and amasses followers, does not make it holy, as I'm certain you realize. Nor does the mere appearance of holiness evidence validity.

Check out the link:

The Apostles of Infinite Love – Magnificat

Then do a google search to find out the history involved.

It is true that a priest consecrated as a bishop by Archbishop Thuc would be validly consecrated, but that begs the question: Did he actually consecrate bishops? How would a person determine whether he actually did?

That's the very matter in contention.

On this particular "Thuc line," no one can demonstrate the issue with any certainty at all, as everything was purportedly done in secret and there were less than 6 people who made the initial allegation (they are all now deceased).

The SSPX never had anything to do with the so called "Thuc line" bishops, as the SSPX believed their validity to be doubtful at best, assuming they even actually took place.

Father Sanborn himself held that position for years.

Contrast that with the episcopal consecrations conducted by Archbishop Lefebvre: done out in the open air, filmed on television, with thousands of people present, another bishop involved, and dozens of other clergy in attendance.

(2) Archbishop Lefebvre Consecration Sermon June 1988 - YouTube

I could never base my salvation simply on the word of two laymen who produced a couple of alleged photos and wrote on them.

What does that prove?

And although Father Sanborn is a valid priest (as I stated, I first met him in the 70's before the "Northeast Nine" episode), I would not consider him a bishop. Ditto for Father Dolan, now deceased. Same for Father Kelly and the dozens of other, what at one time were called "garage bishops" (as in, a bishop in every garage) due to the fact that so many of them were being "consecrated" in the so called Thuc line.

There are hundreds of bishops who were allegedly consecrated by Clemente Dominguez, who ostensibly ended up as the first pope without eyes. He has had several successors.

Archbishop Thuc was at one time involved with this group.

Iglesia Catolica Palmariana (palmarianchurch.org)

Same for Mr. Schuckardt, whose group I came in contact with in the late 70s.

Frankly, I don't know why anyone would entrust their salvation to any of these fringe groups. It is unfortunate that "the Nine" could not remain in the SSPX. As time goes on, their claims to validity become more dubious, and their numbers dwindle to insignificance.
foward
I prefer Gregorian chant, but this music is not a problem.
CatMuse
schmaltzy
Laura Yunque
What a time to be alive! Through the grace of God and by His Hand, I was moved from N.O. and brought into Tradition, the Truth. Since being in Tradition, I am now understanding that there are divisions among those who believe they are practicing the true Catholic faith. This is very painful. We have the SSPX, the SSPV the SSPX-MC and then a smattering of individual priests and bishops out there who …More
What a time to be alive! Through the grace of God and by His Hand, I was moved from N.O. and brought into Tradition, the Truth. Since being in Tradition, I am now understanding that there are divisions among those who believe they are practicing the true Catholic faith. This is very painful. We have the SSPX, the SSPV the SSPX-MC and then a smattering of individual priests and bishops out there who are on their own. Each one of these groups and individuals is firing at the other. It is terrible. There is no refuge, there is no peace and there won't be for quite some time. There are those within Tradition who may not be receiving valid sacraments because of all of this fighting. I don't understand a lot of it. It just seems to me that everybody thinks he's right and everyone else is wrong. I will cling to Tradition, the true Catholic faith, but I got to tell you, the fighting among these men is disheartening. It isn't just that they're fighting, but they all think they're right and they can't all be right. We know that the N.O. is wrong. However, why can't those in Tradition agree? How is it that some are rejecting things like baptism of fire? How is it that some do not accept that the office of the papacy is occupied right now? Some think we haven't had a pope in over 30 years. - How is this? It just all seems so very wrong. They all think they're right They all think they have the fullness of the Truth. They all think they alone are the ones who are holding on to Tradition and yet they can't agree.Many of these priests and bishops are forming their own churches, each one claiming they are right and they alone have the Catholic Truth. It's as if synodality is happening even among Tradition. It just seems that She's breaking apart at the seams no matter where we look.
Seabass
I'm a convert from the NO to Tradition. It seems to me the level of Truth one reaches is directly related to how many magesterial documents they're willing to read. It's surprising how many won't read a one page Papal Bull.
Irishpol
We were told there would be “diabolical disorientation”. We now witness it.
Darrell J Roman
Dear Laura... I agree with you 100%... There will come a time when we will once again be One! As a priest I am also torn and wonder like you do, but I truly believe that in time and only God know when, there will be a truly "Holy Father" that will bring all of these Traditional Fractions into one fold. I will take a strong man to be able to put a stop to all of the smoke of Satan that has been …More
Dear Laura... I agree with you 100%... There will come a time when we will once again be One! As a priest I am also torn and wonder like you do, but I truly believe that in time and only God know when, there will be a truly "Holy Father" that will bring all of these Traditional Fractions into one fold. I will take a strong man to be able to put a stop to all of the smoke of Satan that has been brought into the Church before the Second Vatican Council and now after the Council not only the Smoke of Satan, but Satan himself. What the men of Rome are doing now is purely Diabolical, but have faith and trust in Holy Mother the Church. Christ will not let His Bride be destroyed completely. There will come a time and it is slowly approaching that we will have to go underground, yet that time underground will prepare us for what will follow.
I guess enough of my preaching :)! All we can do is to pray asking God to continue to strengthen us, through the Holy Rosary beg Our Blessed Mother to keep us faithful, to stand up for the Truth and let God take care of the rest.
God bless you and you and many others like you are remembered in my prayers and Holy Masses.
Laura Yunque
Thank you very much, Father.
Chat Chartreux
@Laura Yunque Our Lady warned us of all of this. Let's pray the Rosary daily and often offer it for the priests and bishops. Let's attend Mass often and make reparation for the sins against the Sacred Heart and the Immaculate Heart. Let's trust that Our Lord is "doing the business of His Father" so more souls will be saved. God bless you. Keep the Faith.
Kenjiro M. Yoshimori
Beautiful music, beautiful ceremony. Regardless of "sedevacantism" THIS IS TRUE CATHOLIC, not the garbage that comes from the Vatican of "Pope" Francis. I would attend this ceremony, before I would attend another worthless Vatican II service. The comparisson is stark. One (this) is totally Catholic, and would be recognizable by Catholics 500 years ago. What we have now, any Catholic woo died pre-…More
Beautiful music, beautiful ceremony. Regardless of "sedevacantism" THIS IS TRUE CATHOLIC, not the garbage that comes from the Vatican of "Pope" Francis. I would attend this ceremony, before I would attend another worthless Vatican II service. The comparisson is stark. One (this) is totally Catholic, and would be recognizable by Catholics 500 years ago. What we have now, any Catholic woo died pre-1970 when the Novus Ordo came out would automatically assume that it was Protestant in some Calvinist Church. Which it is.