Francis Asks FSSP Priests to Co-Preside at Novus Ordo Eucharist
On 29 February, Francis mentioned his "wish" to the superiors of the Priestly Fraternity of St Peter (FSSP) that their priests co-preside at the Novus Ordo Chrism Mass, or at least be present during …More
On 29 February, Francis mentioned his "wish" to the superiors of the Priestly Fraternity of St Peter (FSSP) that their priests co-preside at the Novus Ordo Chrism Mass, or at least be present during this event - "while [supposedly] respecting the freedom of each individual priest".
This information is currently circulating in a memo "for internal use only", but is not included in the public communication about the audience.
The secret version was published by Edward Pentin on Twitter.com, but then deleted.
The party language contained in the internal communication can be translated as follows: "Burn incense on the Novus Ordo table or I will take away the Mass from you".
Picture: Atavique, Twitter.com, #newsUzahbhcqtn
This information is currently circulating in a memo "for internal use only", but is not included in the public communication about the audience.
The secret version was published by Edward Pentin on Twitter.com, but then deleted.
The party language contained in the internal communication can be translated as follows: "Burn incense on the Novus Ordo table or I will take away the Mass from you".
Picture: Atavique, Twitter.com, #newsUzahbhcqtn
- Report
Social media
Change post
Remove post
Harry Jones
- Report
Change comment
Remove comment
Concelebration was part of the Lyonese Use before Vatican II:
(It’s really not the hill for the FSSP to die on)More
Concelebration was part of the Lyonese Use before Vatican II:
(It’s really not the hill for the FSSP to die on)
(It’s really not the hill for the FSSP to die on)
John A Cassani
- Report
Change comment
Remove comment
They’re not being asked to concelebrate the ancient Lyonese Rite, but the Novus Ordo. That said, their press release mentions also “being present” for the Chrism Mass as well. The FSSP constitutions, I believe, were required to stipulate that their priests can never be prevented from celebrating the new rites. Sitting in choir for the Chrism Mass, if for no other reasons than to say hello to the …More
They’re not being asked to concelebrate the ancient Lyonese Rite, but the Novus Ordo. That said, their press release mentions also “being present” for the Chrism Mass as well. The FSSP constitutions, I believe, were required to stipulate that their priests can never be prevented from celebrating the new rites. Sitting in choir for the Chrism Mass, if for no other reasons than to say hello to the bishop and pick up the newly blessed/consecrated holy oils is probably not unreasonable. The “hill to die on” may very well be over matters concerning priestly formation, rather than liturgy.
Harry Jones
- Report
Change comment
Remove comment
So, if concelebration isn’t the issue and the Novus Ordo is a valid rite, what precisely is the problem?
Harry Jones
- Report
Change comment
Remove comment
What’s the issue?
From the Catholic Encyclopedia (Fr. Adrian Fortescue):
Concelebration is the rite by which several priests say Mass together, all consecrating the same bread and wine. It was once common in both East and West. As late as the ninth century priests stood around their bishop and "consented to his sacrifice" (Corp. Jur. Can., Decr. Grat., Pars III, dist. I, cap. 59). The rite of …More
What’s the issue?
From the Catholic Encyclopedia (Fr. Adrian Fortescue):
Concelebration is the rite by which several priests say Mass together, all consecrating the same bread and wine. It was once common in both East and West. As late as the ninth century priests stood around their bishop and "consented to his sacrifice" (Corp. Jur. Can., Decr. Grat., Pars III, dist. I, cap. 59). The rite of Concelebration was modified at Rome (perhaps in the time of Pope Zephyrinus, 202-218) so that each priest should consecrate a separate host (the deacons holding these in patens or corporals); but they all consecrated the same chalice ("Ordo Rom. I", 48; see also Duchesne, "Liber Pont.", I, 139 and 246). In the sixth century this rite was observed on all station days; by the eighth century it remained only for the greatest feasts, Easter, Christmas, Whitsunday, and St. Peter ("Ordo Rom. I", 48; Duchesne, "Origines", 167). On other days the priests assisted but did not concelebrate. Innocent III (1198-1216) says that in his time the cardinals concelebrate with the pope on certain feasts (De Saer. Altar. Myst. in Migne, P.L., CCXVII, IV, 25). Durandus, who denied the possibility of such a rite (Rationale Div. Off., IV, d. xiii, q. 3) is refuted by Cardinal Bona (Rer. Liturg., I, xviii, 9). St. Thomas defends its theological correctness (Summa Theol., III:82:2). Concelebration is still common in all the Eastern Churches both Catholic and schismatic. In these, on any greater feast day, the bishop says the holy liturgy surrounded by his priests, who consecrate with him and receive Holy Communion from him, of course under both kinds. So also, at any time, if several priests wish to celebrate on the same day, they may do so together.
From the Catholic Encyclopedia (Fr. Adrian Fortescue):
Concelebration is the rite by which several priests say Mass together, all consecrating the same bread and wine. It was once common in both East and West. As late as the ninth century priests stood around their bishop and "consented to his sacrifice" (Corp. Jur. Can., Decr. Grat., Pars III, dist. I, cap. 59). The rite of Concelebration was modified at Rome (perhaps in the time of Pope Zephyrinus, 202-218) so that each priest should consecrate a separate host (the deacons holding these in patens or corporals); but they all consecrated the same chalice ("Ordo Rom. I", 48; see also Duchesne, "Liber Pont.", I, 139 and 246). In the sixth century this rite was observed on all station days; by the eighth century it remained only for the greatest feasts, Easter, Christmas, Whitsunday, and St. Peter ("Ordo Rom. I", 48; Duchesne, "Origines", 167). On other days the priests assisted but did not concelebrate. Innocent III (1198-1216) says that in his time the cardinals concelebrate with the pope on certain feasts (De Saer. Altar. Myst. in Migne, P.L., CCXVII, IV, 25). Durandus, who denied the possibility of such a rite (Rationale Div. Off., IV, d. xiii, q. 3) is refuted by Cardinal Bona (Rer. Liturg., I, xviii, 9). St. Thomas defends its theological correctness (Summa Theol., III:82:2). Concelebration is still common in all the Eastern Churches both Catholic and schismatic. In these, on any greater feast day, the bishop says the holy liturgy surrounded by his priests, who consecrate with him and receive Holy Communion from him, of course under both kinds. So also, at any time, if several priests wish to celebrate on the same day, they may do so together.
Wilma Lopez shares this
- Report
Remove share
Francis makes clear that the FSSP can only go forward if its priests concelebrate at the NO Chrism Mass
Jan Joseph
- Report
Change comment
Remove comment
Toen bekend werd dat de Sint Petrus broederschap FSSP een gesprek hadden met paus Franciscus was mijn eerste reactie, dit voorspelt weinig goeds. En ja hoor, paus Franciscus, de Duivel, wil dat de priesters van de Petrus broederschap, onder het mom van een Novo Ordo Chrismische Heilige Mis, hun Tridentijnse Romeinse Heilige Mis te verbieden. De Novo Ordo mis staat voor het Tweede Vaticaanse Concilie …More
Toen bekend werd dat de Sint Petrus broederschap FSSP een gesprek hadden met paus Franciscus was mijn eerste reactie, dit voorspelt weinig goeds. En ja hoor, paus Franciscus, de Duivel, wil dat de priesters van de Petrus broederschap, onder het mom van een Novo Ordo Chrismische Heilige Mis, hun Tridentijnse Romeinse Heilige Mis te verbieden. De Novo Ordo mis staat voor het Tweede Vaticaanse Concilie geloof, terwijl de Vetus Ordo Heilige Mis, van de Sint Petrus broederschap, met haar prachtige Tridentijnse Romeinse Heilige Mis staat voor het ware Universele Rooms Katholieke geloof van voor het Tweede Vaticaanse Concilie. Paus Franciscus wil dus de Sint Petrus FSSP ook haar ware Rooms Katholieke geloof ontnemen. De gelovigen van de Sint Petrus broederschap FSSP, jonge hoog opgeleide zonder geloof opgevoede zeer traditionele gelovigen met grote gezinnen kijken op paus Franciscus neer en willen niets met hem te maken hebben. Als de Sint Petrus broederschap zich laat verleiden door paus Franciscus, de Duivel, valt hun broederschap in veel stukken uiteen.
Patricia McKeever
- Report
Change comment
Remove comment
I hope the FSSP will fight this if it comes to having to make a decision.
