It appears! Abp Viganò is one of them!
2015 at the U.S. Capitol. “Upon reading the archbishop’s letter to me, the question came to me, and it has come to others a well: Did he actually write the letter? Yes, he signed the letter, and the …More
2015 at the U.S. Capitol.
“Upon reading the archbishop’s letter to me, the question came to me, and it has come to others a well: Did he actually write the letter? Yes, he signed the letter, and the letter may express his thought, but was he the one who composed on his computer the main arguments contained in the letter? I suspect not. The archbishop customarily writes in a hasty, meandering, stream-of-consciousness manner. Because of this manner of composing, he often does not express himself in a clear and logical manner, and thus, often he has to offer later corrections or clarifications. In his present letter to me, the style is much different. The arguments are clearly and logically put forward, though they are, while clever, counterfeit. Nonetheless, the stylistic marks of this letter manifest a hand that is not the archbishop’s. This does not undermine the letter’s authenticity, but it does mean that the archbishop is influenced by someone who shares the same false ideology as …More
“Upon reading the archbishop’s letter to me, the question came to me, and it has come to others a well: Did he actually write the letter? Yes, he signed the letter, and the letter may express his thought, but was he the one who composed on his computer the main arguments contained in the letter? I suspect not. The archbishop customarily writes in a hasty, meandering, stream-of-consciousness manner. Because of this manner of composing, he often does not express himself in a clear and logical manner, and thus, often he has to offer later corrections or clarifications. In his present letter to me, the style is much different. The arguments are clearly and logically put forward, though they are, while clever, counterfeit. Nonetheless, the stylistic marks of this letter manifest a hand that is not the archbishop’s. This does not undermine the letter’s authenticity, but it does mean that the archbishop is influenced by someone who shares the same false ideology as …More
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F M Shyanguya
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Long before Abp Viganò, it has been revealed they set up Abp Lefebvre to split the Church.
Cf SSPX: How is disobedience a good thing?More
Long before Abp Viganò, it has been revealed they set up Abp Lefebvre to split the Church.
Cf SSPX: How is disobedience a good thing?
Cf SSPX: How is disobedience a good thing?
F M Shyanguya
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@Don Reto Nay SSPX hasn’t ordained any Bishops since 1988.
Would you happen to know the reason they give for this?More
@Don Reto Nay SSPX hasn’t ordained any Bishops since 1988.
Would you happen to know the reason they give for this?
Would you happen to know the reason they give for this?
Don Reto Nay
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I don't know the reason but I guess it: So far they had no need for more bishops.
F M Shyanguya
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@Don Reto Nay
Only they can answer. From my vantage, they have now lost three: 2 consecrating + Williamson. 50% reduction.
Only they can answer. From my vantage, they have now lost three: 2 consecrating + Williamson. 50% reduction.
F M Shyanguya
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@Don Reto Nay
I have asked this: SSPX: How is disobedience a good thing?More
Don Reto Nay
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@F M Shyanguya: "Dying excommunicated" in a Church that was happy with Rahner, Küng, apostasy and heresy, may not mean all that much...
F M Shyanguya
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@Don Reto Nay ... Rahner, Küng, apostasy and heresy, may not mean all that much...
Surely you must see that this is irrelevant and unrelated to the late Abp case. I will return to this in closing. Also, I perceive a veiled attack on the Church.
Clearly to you and the up-voter being excommunicated may not mean much. To God and his Church, it must.
The one excommunicated rejected ex post facto the …More
@Don Reto Nay ... Rahner, Küng, apostasy and heresy, may not mean all that much...
Surely you must see that this is irrelevant and unrelated to the late Abp case. I will return to this in closing. Also, I perceive a veiled attack on the Church.
Clearly to you and the up-voter being excommunicated may not mean much. To God and his Church, it must.
The one excommunicated rejected ex post facto the very decrees of the council he himself signed off on and then proceeded to found a society that to this day has no canonical status within the Church.
If the matters in the Church were bad then, surely they are much worse now. Don’t see anyone, including Traditionalists, doing such as the Archbishop did.
(Note that Bp Williamson was kicked out of the society and has proceeded to consecrate other Bishops.)
Dialogue? The popes Pope St Paul VI [I was shocked to learn this], Pope St John Paul II, and finally Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI all very patiently dialogued with the Archbishop and his society.
And then finally the Archbishop incurred excommunication and involved others by performing episcopal ordinations without the Pope’s approval and despite being warned. SSPX acknowledges that this was an unlawful act, and therefore, it wasn’t for his “orthodoxy” that he was excommunicated. Cf (link)
Surely you must see that this is irrelevant and unrelated to the late Abp case. I will return to this in closing. Also, I perceive a veiled attack on the Church.
Clearly to you and the up-voter being excommunicated may not mean much. To God and his Church, it must.
The one excommunicated rejected ex post facto the very decrees of the council he himself signed off on and then proceeded to found a society that to this day has no canonical status within the Church.
If the matters in the Church were bad then, surely they are much worse now. Don’t see anyone, including Traditionalists, doing such as the Archbishop did.
(Note that Bp Williamson was kicked out of the society and has proceeded to consecrate other Bishops.)
Dialogue? The popes Pope St Paul VI [I was shocked to learn this], Pope St John Paul II, and finally Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI all very patiently dialogued with the Archbishop and his society.
And then finally the Archbishop incurred excommunication and involved others by performing episcopal ordinations without the Pope’s approval and despite being warned. SSPX acknowledges that this was an unlawful act, and therefore, it wasn’t for his “orthodoxy” that he was excommunicated. Cf (link)
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Don Reto Nay
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I don't know whether the excommunication was an "unlawful act", it was certainly deeply injust, you can not apply the harshness of the law against the Catholics and use the same law to promote heresy and apostasy of the liberals. I know what I am talking about. I was in Switzerland at the time and so was Lefebvre.
@F M Shyanguya
"he was excommunicated"
No he was not. In Ecclesia Dei (the document in which John Paul II admitted that there were novelties in VII documents - novelties hard to accept by Catholics even after a quarter of the century) Vatican claimed that Archbishop had incurred the excommunication ipso facto or latae sententiae. No canonical process ending with the excommunication was performed. …More
@F M Shyanguya
"he was excommunicated"
No he was not. In Ecclesia Dei (the document in which John Paul II admitted that there were novelties in VII documents - novelties hard to accept by Catholics even after a quarter of the century) Vatican claimed that Archbishop had incurred the excommunication ipso facto or latae sententiae. No canonical process ending with the excommunication was performed. Therefore there are two possibilities - John Paul II was right that the excommunication had been incurred or Msgr. Lefebvre was right that it had not. It is the legal, canonical question - the Pope is bound by the canon law he has promulgated. Neither the question of doctrine nor the question of infallibility. Old Archbishop took the risk that he would be labeled as "excommunicated" because he thought it was worth to take one.
"he was excommunicated"
No he was not. In Ecclesia Dei (the document in which John Paul II admitted that there were novelties in VII documents - novelties hard to accept by Catholics even after a quarter of the century) Vatican claimed that Archbishop had incurred the excommunication ipso facto or latae sententiae. No canonical process ending with the excommunication was performed. Therefore there are two possibilities - John Paul II was right that the excommunication had been incurred or Msgr. Lefebvre was right that it had not. It is the legal, canonical question - the Pope is bound by the canon law he has promulgated. Neither the question of doctrine nor the question of infallibility. Old Archbishop took the risk that he would be labeled as "excommunicated" because he thought it was worth to take one.
F M Shyanguya
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Why is this comment of mine being removed?!
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F M Shyanguya
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What I have against Abp Lefebvre +, who died excommunicated from the Church, and now Abp Viganò cf. The Church is One.
They are to be condemned and not celebrated, and the faithful would do well to distance themselves from them and from those who champion them.
They rend/attempt to rend the One Body of Christ.More
What I have against Abp Lefebvre +, who died excommunicated from the Church, and now Abp Viganò cf. The Church is One.
They are to be condemned and not celebrated, and the faithful would do well to distance themselves from them and from those who champion them.
They rend/attempt to rend the One Body of Christ.
They are to be condemned and not celebrated, and the faithful would do well to distance themselves from them and from those who champion them.
They rend/attempt to rend the One Body of Christ.
With no respect intended, FMS, go away you troll!
F M Shyanguya
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@Carolan And your argument?
JMJ
Dear Excellency
Quoting from the Gospel of St John chapter 10.
We the little people of the Church are so grateful to Our Lord that He has given us a Shepherd prepared to guard the sheep door. 2 But he that entereth in by the door is the shepherd of the sheep. See moreDG +AB Vigano we stand with you "PETITION"More
JMJ
Dear Excellency
Quoting from the Gospel of St John chapter 10.
We the little people of the Church are so grateful to Our Lord that He has given us a Shepherd prepared to guard the sheep door. 2 But he that entereth in by the door is the shepherd of the sheep. See moreDG +AB Vigano we stand with you "PETITION"
Dear Excellency
Quoting from the Gospel of St John chapter 10.
We the little people of the Church are so grateful to Our Lord that He has given us a Shepherd prepared to guard the sheep door. 2 But he that entereth in by the door is the shepherd of the sheep. See moreDG +AB Vigano we stand with you "PETITION"
Don Reto Nay
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One can likely not be a Nuncio in the United States without meeting the bishops of the United States. It's important that Viganò didn't play the game to the end.
F M Shyanguya
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@Don Reto Nay And who is championing Abp Viganò who is championing President Trump?
Threads easy to connect.More
@Don Reto Nay And who is championing Abp Viganò who is championing President Trump?
Threads easy to connect.
Threads easy to connect.
Don Reto Nay
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Both are not really championed by the great powers, I guess.
F M Shyanguya
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@Don Reto Nay My assertion is that Dr. Marshall [from a Freemasonic family] and Abp Viganò and President Trump are all on the same team working for the Antichrist and against the Church.
PS Extending from your comment, and most of the Bishops in the US, given their CoViD response.
But the LORD always keeps for himself those whose knees never bow to Ba’al, and who have not kissed him [Ba’al].More
@Don Reto Nay My assertion is that Dr. Marshall [from a Freemasonic family] and Abp Viganò and President Trump are all on the same team working for the Antichrist and against the Church.
PS Extending from your comment, and most of the Bishops in the US, given their CoViD response.
But the LORD always keeps for himself those whose knees never bow to Ba’al, and who have not kissed him [Ba’al].
PS Extending from your comment, and most of the Bishops in the US, given their CoViD response.
But the LORD always keeps for himself those whose knees never bow to Ba’al, and who have not kissed him [Ba’al].
![](https://seedus2043.gloriatv.net/storage1/uvvgtkp5ahual1vx2axr33rhes907s7w4wfpv2d.webp?crop=1280.673.0.47&scale=on&secure=UDkXT7zAmjKOTQeBk_BHLw&expires=1724364856)
@F M Shyanguya Your linking of the 'threads' seems more of a 'Baader Meinhof' phenomena than reality based facts.
Caroline03
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Fr Weinandy take a moment to read the Gospel in a Traditional Bible,
archive.org/…/Douay-Rheims-16…
.....then seek out a few Papal Encyclicals of the true Popes and then browse through the writings of the Early Church Fathers. You will then discern a similarity between THEIR writings and those of this clearly ROMAN Catholic Archbishop.
The author of HIS writings is the one that preaches sound …More
Fr Weinandy take a moment to read the Gospel in a Traditional Bible,
archive.org/…/Douay-Rheims-16…
.....then seek out a few Papal Encyclicals of the true Popes and then browse through the writings of the Early Church Fathers. You will then discern a similarity between THEIR writings and those of this clearly ROMAN Catholic Archbishop.
The author of HIS writings is the one that preaches sound doctrine, rebukes, and urges people to hold fast to the Faith as it was handed down to them....
The Holy Spirit.
The same Holy Spirit who inspires ALL who submit themselves to the Sacred Magesterium of the Roman Catholic Church
As a composer, not much that is any worth is likely to pour forth from me until I put myself in the hands of God and aim to submit all that I am writing to CHRIST - using Him as the only source of inspiration. Suddenly then the music becomes enlivened with an undeniable grace.......... So, due to this I am puzzled to find that a Priest who has a mind set on gaining Heaven, who became a Priest in order to serve Christ is apparently unable to discern the familiar pious voice of the Holy Ghost. It's appalling really.
archive.org/…/Douay-Rheims-16…
.....then seek out a few Papal Encyclicals of the true Popes and then browse through the writings of the Early Church Fathers. You will then discern a similarity between THEIR writings and those of this clearly ROMAN Catholic Archbishop.
The author of HIS writings is the one that preaches sound doctrine, rebukes, and urges people to hold fast to the Faith as it was handed down to them....
The Holy Spirit.
The same Holy Spirit who inspires ALL who submit themselves to the Sacred Magesterium of the Roman Catholic Church
As a composer, not much that is any worth is likely to pour forth from me until I put myself in the hands of God and aim to submit all that I am writing to CHRIST - using Him as the only source of inspiration. Suddenly then the music becomes enlivened with an undeniable grace.......... So, due to this I am puzzled to find that a Priest who has a mind set on gaining Heaven, who became a Priest in order to serve Christ is apparently unable to discern the familiar pious voice of the Holy Ghost. It's appalling really.